In this Bible study podcast, Andy Davis goes line by line through Hebrews 5:11-6:3. The author strongly exhorts the Hebrews to leave their infancy and go on to maturity. He would like to teach them more weighty doctrines but they are not able to accept them because their minds are not properly trained through “constant practice” of solid food-advanced Christian doctrine. This is a word of rebuke to the modem evangelical church which can never seem to get out of the same infancy of basic Christian truths.
The author strongly exhorts the Hebrews to leave their infancy and go on to maturity. He would like to teach them more weighty doctrines but they are not able to accept them because their minds are not properly trained through “constant practice” of solid food-advanced Christian doctrine. This is a word of rebuke to the modem evangelical church which can never seem to get out of the same infancy of basic Christian truths.
– PODCAST TRANSCRIPT –
Joel
Hi. Welcome to the Two Journeys podcast. This is episode 11 in Bible study questions from the book of Hebrews. Today we’re looking at Hebrews 5:11-6:3, and the title is, “You Should be Mature, but You Still Need Milk.” Andy, this is kind of a stinging section of scripture where the recipients really get a hefty rebuke. Can you give us a brief overview of this section?
Andy
Absolutely. This is a very, very powerful convicting section of scripture that is urging all of us continually to be moving from immaturity to maturity, from infancy to being fully grown in Christ. The author seems somewhat put out with these Hebrews at this point, and so there’s a sense that there’s a pressure on us that we’re being pressed by this text to not be complacent, to not be lazy in our walk with Christ, but to go on to maturity.
Joel
Well, for the sake of our audience, I’m going to read the text, and I’m also going to back up just a couple verses. It talks about how Jesus is a high priest after the order of Melchizedek, and so he introduces this deep theological subject, which is where we get the rebuke. So, I’m going to start in verse 8, talking about Jesus, and then we’ll run on through 6:3, “Although he [Jesus] was a son, he learned obedience through what he suffered. And being made perfect, he became the source of eternal salvation to all who obey him, being designated by God a high priest after the order of Melchizedek. [Verse 11] About this, we have much to say, and it is hard to explain since you have become dull of hearing. For though by this time you ought to be teachers, you need someone to teach you again the basic principles of the oracles of God. You need milk, not solid food, for everyone who lives on milk is unskilled in the word of righteousness, since he is a child. But solid food is for the mature, for those who have their powers of discernment trained by constant practice to distinguish good from evil. Therefore let us leave the elementary doctrine of Christ and go on to maturity, not laying again a foundation of repentance from dead works and of faith toward God, and of instructions about washings, the laying on of hands, the resurrection of the dead, and eternal judgment. And this we will do if God permits.” (Hebrews 5:8-6:3) So my first question for you, Andy, is what is the problem that the author is dealing with in these verses?
Andy
Well, the author is dealing with spiritual immaturity. He’s dealing with, again, big picture. The author is writing this book to Jewish professors of faith in Christ who were under pressure to turn their backs on Christ and to go back to old Covenant Judaism. He’s looking really at the heart of the problem, and the heart of the problem is their own walk with Christ. In this text, he’s going to say they need to be taught some things they already learned. So, they are under the corrosive influence of the world, the flesh, and the devil, which we looked at in chapter 3, where there’s this hardening effect through the deceitfulness of sin. Or as it said in chapter 2, “We must pay more careful attention to what we’ve heard, so that we do not drift away from them,” (paraphrase of Hebrews 2:1) and so from the things that we’ve heard. So, these folks have been under pressure from the world, the flesh, and the devil, and are in a worse place than they were just sometime before that. They had learned some solid doctrinal things, but under that pressure from the world, the flesh and the devil, they were at a worse place now than they were before, and so the author is dealing with spiritual immaturity and their failure to progress.
Joel
So, you mentioned the failure to progress. What do these verses teach us about God’s expectations for progress or growth in the Christian life?
Andy
It’s vital for us to understand that, really it is, that justification through faith in Christ is just the beginning of the Christian life, a healthy Christian life, just like all healthy living things grow and develop. That’s part of the process of life that we should be seeing progress in our Christian lives. It’s not enough to just come to simple faith in Christ for the forgiveness of our sins. There now should be a principle of life in us through the Holy Spirit that causes us to make progress. And that progress in the Christian life is called, sanctification or conformity to Christ, Christ likeness, we’re growing in Christ likeness. So, we need to hear really not so much the author to the book of Hebrews, but Christ himself, or our Heavenly Father saying, “You need to make progress. It’s not enough to stay an infant in Christ.”
“That justification through faith in Christ is just the beginning of the Christian life, a healthy Christian life, just like all healthy living things grow and develop.”
Joel
Right. I really appreciate how you’ve emphasized that in your teaching ministry, specifically that salvation is bigger than justification. A lot of people associate those two together, just salvation with justification. But it’s been really helpful for my Christian walk, and I know for a lot of the guys in this church, that salvation is bigger than justification. It includes sanctification and we must not neglect this growth.
Andy
Yeah, I think if you think of the entire New Testament is written to primarily, it seems to Christians. Obviously, there’s evangelistic power and so you could think of some of the text written to non-Christians, and I understand that, but it’s written to people to move them on from point A to point B, to C, to D, to all the way to Z. So, we are to keep moving in the Christian life.
Joel
Yeah. All right, let’s get into some of the details here. He says, about this, we have much to say and it’s hard to explain since you’ve become dull of hearing. So, he interrupts and he was about to teach them about Melchizedek and how Jesus is in the line of Melchizedek. But then he says, “You ought to be teachers, but you need someone to teach you again the basic principles of the Oracles of God.” (Hebrews 5:12) So what are these basic principles of the Oracles of God?
Andy
Sure. He’s going to, I think list them at the beginning of the next chapter still in this text, but it’s just the kinds of things you would explain in a very simple, clear way in an evangelistic encounter with a non-Christian. The basic facts of the gospel, that’s the milk. So, these are things that we would explain to a beginner, or to somebody who is asking, “Tell me more about Christianity.” But the idea here is that we do need to move on from the milk onto the meat. Now, concerning Melchizedek, he’s going to go into that in great detail in chapter 7, so we don’t have to wait for long, but almost all of chapter 6 is an interruption here, and so we’re going to continue to develop this same concern that the author has about their failure to progress. This is a big deal for him, so he gives us a whole chapter. We’re going to, God willing, talk more about that next time. But honestly, he says, “Look, I have a lot to say about Melchizedek, but you’re not ready because there’s been this degeneration happening in you. You’re worse off now than you were some time ago.”
Joel
Yeah. He says they’ve become dull of hearing.
Andy
Yes. Yeah.
Joel
What does that mean?
Andy
Yeah, I think that’s got to bring us back to chapter 3, where he talks about the hardening effect of sin’s deceitfulness. So, I think their hearts are harder now. They’ve been marinating in sin’s deceitfulness. They’ve been tempted by the world. They’ve been enticed to go back from a courageous, bold testimony of Christ, as we’re going to find out later in the book, how they joyfully accepted the confiscation of their possessions because they were convinced that they had better and lasting possession in Christ. So, they were at that high level. Now they’ve regressed. They’ve backslid, it seems, and so they have become hard of hearing. I think it really has to do with the hardness of the heart. They’re not as yielded or supple to the leading of the Spirit anymore.
Joel
Yeah. That makes a lot of sense. This dull of hearing, dull to hear the word of God, it doesn’t have the same piercing effect on your heart like it used to. So how do you think this would’ve felt for them to hear that they ought to be teachers, but instead, they still need milk? How would that have felt to receive that rebuke?
Andy
I think it must’ve hurt. I mean, if they were serious about walking with Christ, if they just blew it off, then you’d wonder if they’re even converted. But you really have to feel that the Apostles, the writers of scripture, the prophets, are speaking for God. They’re speaking God’s words. So really, behind the human author, you have to hear a heavenly Father who is expressing disappointment in one of his children or in a group of his children. Anyone that really loves his or her father, you hear something like that, it’s going to crush you. It’s very hard to hear. I think the idea is to spur them on toward loving good deeds, as the author is going to say later, to provoke them to get moving. There is this heavy-handed feel here of, “I am disappointed with you. I expected you to make progress faster than this and instead, you’re very slow to progress.”
Joel
Now, what would you say to perhaps somebody listening who as they’re hearing these verses, they feel themselves in that position. Maybe they were saved three years ago, five years ago, 10 years ago, maybe longer, and even just as we’re reading this, they realized they haven’t progressed hardly at all in the Christian life. They do believe, but they’re not progressing. What kind of advice would you give them?
Andy
Well first, I just want to encourage such a person for even listening to a podcast like this. It could be that the Holy Spirit is working in some marvelous ways to draw you back toward the word of God or perhaps, for the first time, toward a careful study of the word of God as never before. That is clear evidence of the Spirit’s working, so I just want to speak a word of encouragement to somebody like that. But in general, I think there is a feeling here of a pressure, or even a rebuke or correction to somebody that has a long time been at a level of immaturity in the Christian life, that that’s not okay, and that they need to be spurred to get up and to exert themselves. There is an effort here, or there is a sense of personal exertion in holiness, personal exertion in growth. So yeah, it’s sovereignty of God, absolutely, but also, he works in us to will and to do according to his good purpose. I think there’s the idea of you’ve been neglecting this, you have sinned in being still immature after all this time.
Joel
Right. So, God commands us in 2 Peter, he says, “Grow in the grace and knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ.” (2 Peter 3:18) Then Paul says, it is God who gives the growth. So, I guess you’ve already explained then how to put those together.
Andy
I don’t fully understand it, but I think we just need to know the rules are different in sanctification than justification. In justification, our works are not welcome. We need to abandon them, check them at the door, they will not help us. We are never justified by obedience to the law of God, cannot be. We are justified by Christ’s obedience to the law, by his works, not by ours. So, we have to trust in him by faith alone, through grace alone, not by works. But when you get to sanctification, there are so many verses and so many exhortations to us to, like it says in Philippians, like I mentioned a moment ago, work out our own salvation with fear and trembling. So, we have to work at it.
“We are never justified by obedience to the law of God, cannot be. We are justified by Christ’s obedience to the law, by his works, not by ours.”
Part of it, I think, is this whole epistle, an epistle of warning, an epistle of rebuke, a sharp epistle. It’s needed. We need to hear this. We need to sometimes be jolted wide awake by words like this. So, once we do, we’ve got to get going. So, for here, it’s a doctrinal question. It has to do with the fact that they have to develop a taste for, and perhaps even teeth for, to follow the metaphor, teeth for advanced doctrines in the Christian life, to not just continue to sip on the idea that there is a good God who made everything, and he sent his Son because we’re sinners, and if we believe in Jesus, we’ll be forgiven. That’s all milk to move on to something deeper, something fuller and richer. That’s what this text is urging us to do.
Joel
So that leads into my next question. What is the significant difference then between the infants he mentions and the mature? You mentioned the ability to chew on tough doctrine. Why is it so important that we be able to understand deeper doctrines? Why can’t we just be satisfied with understanding Christ in my place, I’m going to heaven.? Why do we have to press on, specifically towards deeper doctrine?
Andy
Yeah, well first of all, I want to branch out a little bit and say this isn’t the only passage of scripture that talks about the milk-meat dichotomy. 1 Corinthians 3 does as well. In there, Paul is just as put out with them as this author has put out with his audience, and there you’ve got Paul rebuking the Corinthians for being fleshly, or sometimes the translation is carnal, and he says, you need milk, not solid food or meat. So, the milk-meat dichotomy, you’re going to see it there as well.
So, in a recent sermon in 1 Corinthians, I was thinking about what is milk? What is meat? So, I’ve just defined milk as basically those doctrines, those initiating doctrines that you would share in an evangelistic setting with somebody who is finding out about the Christian life, or that you would believe to become a Christian. Meat then would be advanced doctrines. Now, we’ll keep it simple. The doctrine about Melchizedek must be meat because the author doesn’t want to give it to them yet. He holds it back. So, in his mind, that’s meat. So, once you read what that’s all about, the typology of Melchizedek, the fact that there are types, shadows in the Old Testament law, I think the idea with meat there is of a complex array of doctrines that gets built up, building block by building block. So, it takes time to accept this, and accept that, and put it all together, what the old Covenant even was, what was involved in it, and how it was a type or shadow of Christ, and how Melchizedek fits in and who he is. He’s going to develop all that, but that’s meat. It’s complex doctrine that gets built up by building blocks.
Another way to look at meat would be those things that I think are very difficult for us to accept and understand, initially. They make no sense to the carnal mind or to the unconverted mind. So those would be controversial doctrines, things that are hard for us to accept like predestination, election, God’s sovereignty, providence, things like that. Anything that we are wired to reject, it’s going to take spiritual teeth to chew into that. Then finally, just the idea of denying yourself and taking up your cross daily and following Christ, that’s there at the beginning of the Christian life, but we don’t really know what that means, and we start to learn it more and more in that. The cross itself, ironically, is both milk and meat in that regard. It’s the initiating doctrine, but you’re never going to walk away from the cross. The rest of your life, you have to learn what it means to deny yourself and die. So, mortification of sin at a deep level, all of that is meat.
Joel
Right. So, this is incredibly glorifying to God then to see his people pressing on towards maturity, towards diving into the meat, the secrets revealed in the Old Testament, the deep things of God.
Andy
Yeah, it is glorifying to God. First of all, we’re taking him at his word, and we’re thinking that the things he’s saying to us through the scripture by the Holy Spirit are worth listening to. Think how rude it would be if you visited, let’s say, a grandmother, a grandfather maybe in a rest home or just in their own home, and you just feel like they talk too much, and they just talk, and talk, and talk, and you just check out, yeah, yeah, yeah. You’re being very rude, actually, very rude. Effectively, what you’re saying to that person is the things you’re saying are not important to me. The things that you’re talking… You just talk too much.
I almost feel like infant Christians are saying to God, “You just talk too much. You say too much. I got it. I believe in Jesus. My sins are forgiven. I got it. Why do you need 66 books to say all that?” It’s like, wait a minute, now. All scripture is God-breathed. Everything in this book is worth studying, worth our full attention. Those things that are hardest to understand and hardest to accept, that just shows love for God to say, “I love you so much. I really want to understand what you’re saying to me at these points.”
Joel
Yeah, that’s huge. So, to get really practical, what are some specific duties that someone can take to ensure that they’re not falling into the pattern of this group of Hebrews, but that they are pressing onto maturity, that they’re learning to digest the meat doctrines?
Andy
Well, I would commend two habits that have been helpful for me. First of all, we must be talking primarily here about the word of God and how we handle all of God’s word, because that’s the source of both the milk and the meat. So, we want to be in God’s word, but I would advocate knowledge and breadth, plus knowledge and depth. If you do both of those, you’re going to run into both milk and meat. You’re going to run into them all the time. By the way, there’s nothing wrong for us enjoying the milk. Even as Christians have been around for decades, it’s still wonderful to know that there’s a loving God who made all things, and that he sent his Son, and that we who have violated God’s laws can be and are forgiven by simple faith in Christ. We can drink that the rest of our lives, and there’s nothing wrong, and everything right with it.
But the idea here is, I think, to go on to maturity, to go on from infancy to full maturity in Christ, we need to be in the Word more and more. So, I would advocate some habit patterns of knowledge and breadth, plus knowledge and depth. So, knowledge and breadth would be reading through the entire Bible in a year, let’s say. Or if you have more time, in six months. There are different reading programs that you can get in that through half an hour, 40 minutes a day will get you through the Bible in six months. About half that will get you through the entire Bible in one year. So just begin a regular program of Bible intake every single day.
As you’re reading, you want to meditate on it, and that will bring you to knowledge and depth. So, choose something from your reading, something that maybe you didn’t understand, you hadn’t thought about before, and just pray over it and meditate on it. Maybe do some deeper study in it, do some cross references. One helpful discipline for knowledge and depth is memorization of extended portions of scripture, so that you would choose a book of the Bible, a New Testament epistle like Ephesians or Philippians, or maybe a great chapter like Roman’s 8, or a section like the Sermon on the Mount, and memorize it. As you go over it and learn every word, you’re going to be meditating on it automatically, and your knowledge of the word of God is going to deepen and broaden. I guarantee, somewhere in there you’re going to come across some meat. You’re going to say, “Yeah, I really don’t understand this,” and it’s going to broaden you. You’ll be developing your spiritual teeth.
“One helpful discipline for knowledge and depth is memorization of extended portions of scripture.”
Joel
Well, that is really helpful. Now Hebrews 5:14 says that, “Solid food is for the mature, for those who have their powers of discernment trained by constant practice to distinguish good from evil.” So, what additional information does this verse teach us about mature Christians? Just while you’re answering that, what does it mean to distinguish good from evil?
Andy
Well, first of all, there is built within this verse the idea of habits, of a habitual training almost. So that’s just the language of spiritual disciplines. It’s the idea of just like if you try to get better at a sport, or at a musical instrument, or at some kind of craft, or some art, like painting, you just do it. You have to do it a lot. If you want to learn how to play the piano, you have to just practice, and practice, and practice. This is about doctrine so you’re just again and again, in it. You’re in it, you’re immersing yourself in the word of God, and you’re meditating on it, and you’re discussing it with other people. You’re going to mentors who are further along than you in knowledge of doctrine and asking them. You’re reading books. You’re just in this thing, and you’re spending tens of hours, then hundreds of hours, then thousands of hours over years, training yourself by constant use, the text says, so you’re in the word and developing your spiritual teeth.
What’s going to end up happening with that is you’re going to be training your heart and your mind. You’re going to train yourself to be discerning. It’s going to be shaping. You’re going to be transformed by the renewing of your mind. You’re going to start seeing things differently. You’re going to be developing a supernatural faith perspective where you can see not only the physical world, but the invisible spiritual world around it. Can’t see it except by faith, and faith comes by hearing the word of God. So, as you’re in the Word, you’re discerning, you’re training yourself by constant use, you’re able to discern more and more what’s really going on. The author gives us the discerning between good and evil, so you’re discerning what is righteous, and holy, and good, and those things that are wicked and deceitful, and you’re able to make wise choices. It really leads to wisdom at this point.
Joel
Now transition to Hebrews 6:1-3. He says, “Therefore, let us leave the elementary doctrine of Christ and go onto maturity, not laying again a foundation of repentance from dead works and a faith toward God, and of instructions about washing the laying on of hands, the resurrection of the dead, and eternal judgment. And this we will do if God permits”. So, he urges them to go onto maturity, and then he gives us this list of, I guess the basic principles of the oracles of God. It’s an interesting list, especially the instructions about washings. What do you make of this list, as far as introductory Christian doctrine?
Andy
Well, this would be, I think in context, if you read it in context, this would be the author’s list of milk. So that’s what he wants them to leave behind. Now, keep in mind, leave behind, we need to understand that properly. We’re never going to be leaving behind. What does it say? Faith in God, for example, we’re-
Joel
Not leaving behind Christ crucified.
Andy
Yeah, we’re not leaving that behind, but we’re leaving behind the laziness, let’s say, to say I’m satisfied, that this is all I want, leaving behind the fact that I’m going to be here the rest of my life. So, we’re going to move on. I think it’s about the same thing what Paul says in Philippians 3:13, “Forgetting what lies behind and straining toward what lies ahead.” We’re not truly forgetting these things in the past. So, he’s saying, “Yeah, let’s leave behind these basics of the Christian life.” This is basically his provisional list of milk. It is worthwhile just thinking about what he’s talking about here. We’re going to move on from basic elementary teachings about Christ, and we’re going to go on to maturity, “Not laying again [he says] the foundation of repentance from acts that lead to death.” (Hebrews 6:1) So it starts with that foundation.
Now, the Apostle Paul, in 1 Corinthians 3:11 says, “No one can lay any foundation other than the one already laid, which is Jesus Christ.” So, we have to see that they’re not two foundations here. They’re really the same thing. It’s been helpful for me to see faith as the eyesight of the soul. By that eyesight, we see invisible spiritual realities, past, present, future. One of the things that we see here is the finished work of Jesus Christ on the cross. That’s the foundation laid by Jesus. But here, it’s repentance from dead acts, or one translation has acts that lead to death. So, repentance always has to do with sin. So that’s just two sides of the same coin. Faith in Christ, repentance from sin. That’s what you have to do to become a Christian. That’s the foundation of everything. So, we’re not going to lay that foundation again saying, “Hey, you need to believe in Jesus. Hey, you need to repent of your sins.” We already know that, so we’re going to move on from that. That’s the initial kind of milk that he talks about here.
Joel
So, the ESV says also the, “Instructions about washing, the laying on of hands, the resurrection of dead and eternal judgment.” (Hebrews 6:2) I know you’ve got some insight from the NIV as to what the rest of these things were because talking about kind of basic Christian doctrines. Can you talk about verse 2, and what he’s talking about?
Andy
Yeah. I think one of the things I learned in hermeneutics, or the science of interpretation of scripture, is context is king. So, what we want to do here is look at the immediate context first, always the immediate context, and then one circle removed from that, you can get out a little further. So, one circle removed would be Jewish rituals, but the immediate context is beginning Christian doctrines, and that’s the milk that we’re going to move on from. So, I’m going to stick with that. There’s a word that the author uses here, which is I think rightly translated to some degree by the ESV and other translations, washings. But that could lead you to think we’re talking about Jewish washings here, like the kinds that priests would do, the Ablutions and different things priests would do or people would do before they would… like, Jesus was criticized for not washing his hands before eating, and so these kind of washings.
But I think it’s best to look on it in terms of water baptism. So, the idea is there would be certain instructions that would be tied to your water baptism. Again, Peter tells us in 1st Peter 3, not the removal of dirt from the body, but the pledge of a good conscience toward God. So it is that water baptism, but it doesn’t save you. What does save you is the genuine washing of rebirth and renewal by the Holy Spirit. So, the Holy Spirit’s activity on the human soul is likened to a liquid. It’s likened to the outpouring of clean water. So, we are being washed by renewal through the Holy Spirit. Titus 3 tells us that. So, water baptism then becomes an outward and visible symbol of the inner washing done by the Holy Spirit. But again, this is part of a list of things that the author said, “Hey, let’s move on from this now. These are things we taught you about at the beginning of the Christian life. We’re not going to lay again, a foundation of repentance from dead acts and faith in God, and instruction about washings [it says] and the laying on of hands.” Now, what I would say is these are all things that they would’ve done back then at the beginning of the Christian life. So, you can imagine the laying on of hands, and when, for example, Saul of Tarsus was baptized, Ananias baptized him in water, but also laid hands on him that he might be healed, physically, because he was blind, but also that he might receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. So, I think back then, there were supernatural manifestations, such as speaking in tongues or other miracles that would happen, the working of miracles that showed that the Holy Spirit had come on someone, especially speaking in tongues. So, the idea here might be, “Let’s move on from the things we did when you were first converted.” That’s a good way to sum up this whole list. The washings, instruction about washings and laying on of hands would be beginner doctrines.
Joel
Right. That makes a lot of sense. And verse 3, he says, “This we will do if God permits.” (Hebrews 6:3) So why does he add this, if God permits?
Andy
Very weighty, and we’re about to get into one of the most controversial parts of the entire New Testament. We’re going to talk about a very serious chapter of warning, probably one of the most serious warnings you’ll ever find in the New Testament, which causes all of us to look with fear and trembling at our own souls, and to make certain that we’re making progress in the Christian life, and that we are actually bearing fruit, not thorns and thistles, land that is going to be cursed by God, but we are actually fruitful in Christ. That’s where we’re going so, God willing, do that next time.
But he said, “The overall motion of these verses has been from immaturity to maturity, not laying it again, the beginning foundations, but let’s go on to a full edifice, a full beautiful, ornate structure of Christian maturity and God permitting, we will make that progress.” So, for me, what I want to see as I look at that is say, we will not make even a single step of progress apart from God’s will. There is no independent growth in Christ’s likeness. There’s no independent progress from immaturity to maturity. “If God wills, we will live,” (Paraphrase of James 4:15) James tells us, and here if God wills, we will make progress. So first and foremost, you want to make progress in Christ? Focus evermore on God, trust in God, trust in Christ, put your focus on him and say, “Oh God, would you grow me?” You don’t go off by yourself in some field somewhere and grow up independently, and then come back and impress God with your new maturity. You do it in God or you don’t do it at all. So only if God wills, will we grow.
Joel
I have one final question, and then you can answer it and give your final comments. What does this passage about moving from immaturity to maturity, and we talked a lot about Christian doctrine, what specific application would this have to preachers or Bible study teachers, people leading other people in the word of God? How could they apply this to themselves, and then especially to their hearers?
Andy
Yeah, I think it’s very important for preachers on Sunday mornings to not just preach forever the milk of the gospel, week, after week, after week, after week, just preaching the milk of God the creator, God the lawgiver, we created, we violating God’s laws. We need a Savior. Jesus is the Savior. If you’re repent and believe in Jesus, you’ll be forgiven of your sins, and that’s all they ever preach. They never go beyond that. I think we should preach that, literally, every week. You know that I believe that, and I do preach the milk of the gospel every single week.
But I also want to trust the text, and that’s why I would advocate expositional preaching and expositional teaching so that we can encounter the meat. First of all, even if you don’t have teeth to chew it yet, just to know that it exists, and you’re like, huh, what is that? Even just that first glimpse at a doctrine that’s too hard for you to understand will start growing your teeth. It’ll cause within you an ambition to grow to maturity. So, what I would say for preachers and teachers is do not hesitate. Do not shrink back from proclaiming the whole council of God’s word. Give to people the hard doctrines. Do your best to explain them. If you, yourself don’t know what they teach, then grow yourself by reading commentaries and by meditating it, talking to mentors. If in the end, after all that study you still don’t really know, then do your best to explain it and say, “I don’t really know, but this is what I think.” But in any case, by going through the whole council of God’s word, you’re going to be enabling your congregation to grow spiritual teeth and grow up from immaturity to full maturity in Christ.
Joel
Right. Well, thank you Andy. That was episode 11 in the Hebrews Bible study questions. Please join us next time where we talk about Hebrews 6:4-9, and really one of the most serious warnings in all of scripture. The title is “Tasting the Good Gifts Without True Conversion.” Thank you for listening to the Two Journeys podcast, and God bless you all.
The author strongly exhorts the Hebrews to leave their infancy and go on to maturity. He would like to teach them more weighty doctrines but they are not able to accept them because their minds are not properly trained through “constant practice” of solid food-advanced Christian doctrine. This is a word of rebuke to the modem evangelical church which can never seem to get out of the same infancy of basic Christian truths.
– PODCAST TRANSCRIPT –
Joel
Hi. Welcome to the Two Journeys podcast. This is episode 11 in Bible study questions from the book of Hebrews. Today we’re looking at Hebrews 5:11-6:3, and the title is, “You Should be Mature, but You Still Need Milk.” Andy, this is kind of a stinging section of scripture where the recipients really get a hefty rebuke. Can you give us a brief overview of this section?
Andy
Absolutely. This is a very, very powerful convicting section of scripture that is urging all of us continually to be moving from immaturity to maturity, from infancy to being fully grown in Christ. The author seems somewhat put out with these Hebrews at this point, and so there’s a sense that there’s a pressure on us that we’re being pressed by this text to not be complacent, to not be lazy in our walk with Christ, but to go on to maturity.
Joel
Well, for the sake of our audience, I’m going to read the text, and I’m also going to back up just a couple verses. It talks about how Jesus is a high priest after the order of Melchizedek, and so he introduces this deep theological subject, which is where we get the rebuke. So, I’m going to start in verse 8, talking about Jesus, and then we’ll run on through 6:3, “Although he [Jesus] was a son, he learned obedience through what he suffered. And being made perfect, he became the source of eternal salvation to all who obey him, being designated by God a high priest after the order of Melchizedek. [Verse 11] About this, we have much to say, and it is hard to explain since you have become dull of hearing. For though by this time you ought to be teachers, you need someone to teach you again the basic principles of the oracles of God. You need milk, not solid food, for everyone who lives on milk is unskilled in the word of righteousness, since he is a child. But solid food is for the mature, for those who have their powers of discernment trained by constant practice to distinguish good from evil. Therefore let us leave the elementary doctrine of Christ and go on to maturity, not laying again a foundation of repentance from dead works and of faith toward God, and of instructions about washings, the laying on of hands, the resurrection of the dead, and eternal judgment. And this we will do if God permits.” (Hebrews 5:8-6:3) So my first question for you, Andy, is what is the problem that the author is dealing with in these verses?
Andy
Well, the author is dealing with spiritual immaturity. He’s dealing with, again, big picture. The author is writing this book to Jewish professors of faith in Christ who were under pressure to turn their backs on Christ and to go back to old Covenant Judaism. He’s looking really at the heart of the problem, and the heart of the problem is their own walk with Christ. In this text, he’s going to say they need to be taught some things they already learned. So, they are under the corrosive influence of the world, the flesh, and the devil, which we looked at in chapter 3, where there’s this hardening effect through the deceitfulness of sin. Or as it said in chapter 2, “We must pay more careful attention to what we’ve heard, so that we do not drift away from them,” (paraphrase of Hebrews 2:1) and so from the things that we’ve heard. So, these folks have been under pressure from the world, the flesh, and the devil, and are in a worse place than they were just sometime before that. They had learned some solid doctrinal things, but under that pressure from the world, the flesh and the devil, they were at a worse place now than they were before, and so the author is dealing with spiritual immaturity and their failure to progress.
Joel
So, you mentioned the failure to progress. What do these verses teach us about God’s expectations for progress or growth in the Christian life?
Andy
It’s vital for us to understand that, really it is, that justification through faith in Christ is just the beginning of the Christian life, a healthy Christian life, just like all healthy living things grow and develop. That’s part of the process of life that we should be seeing progress in our Christian lives. It’s not enough to just come to simple faith in Christ for the forgiveness of our sins. There now should be a principle of life in us through the Holy Spirit that causes us to make progress. And that progress in the Christian life is called, sanctification or conformity to Christ, Christ likeness, we’re growing in Christ likeness. So, we need to hear really not so much the author to the book of Hebrews, but Christ himself, or our Heavenly Father saying, “You need to make progress. It’s not enough to stay an infant in Christ.”
“That justification through faith in Christ is just the beginning of the Christian life, a healthy Christian life, just like all healthy living things grow and develop.”
Joel
Right. I really appreciate how you’ve emphasized that in your teaching ministry, specifically that salvation is bigger than justification. A lot of people associate those two together, just salvation with justification. But it’s been really helpful for my Christian walk, and I know for a lot of the guys in this church, that salvation is bigger than justification. It includes sanctification and we must not neglect this growth.
Andy
Yeah, I think if you think of the entire New Testament is written to primarily, it seems to Christians. Obviously, there’s evangelistic power and so you could think of some of the text written to non-Christians, and I understand that, but it’s written to people to move them on from point A to point B, to C, to D, to all the way to Z. So, we are to keep moving in the Christian life.
Joel
Yeah. All right, let’s get into some of the details here. He says, about this, we have much to say and it’s hard to explain since you’ve become dull of hearing. So, he interrupts and he was about to teach them about Melchizedek and how Jesus is in the line of Melchizedek. But then he says, “You ought to be teachers, but you need someone to teach you again the basic principles of the Oracles of God.” (Hebrews 5:12) So what are these basic principles of the Oracles of God?
Andy
Sure. He’s going to, I think list them at the beginning of the next chapter still in this text, but it’s just the kinds of things you would explain in a very simple, clear way in an evangelistic encounter with a non-Christian. The basic facts of the gospel, that’s the milk. So, these are things that we would explain to a beginner, or to somebody who is asking, “Tell me more about Christianity.” But the idea here is that we do need to move on from the milk onto the meat. Now, concerning Melchizedek, he’s going to go into that in great detail in chapter 7, so we don’t have to wait for long, but almost all of chapter 6 is an interruption here, and so we’re going to continue to develop this same concern that the author has about their failure to progress. This is a big deal for him, so he gives us a whole chapter. We’re going to, God willing, talk more about that next time. But honestly, he says, “Look, I have a lot to say about Melchizedek, but you’re not ready because there’s been this degeneration happening in you. You’re worse off now than you were some time ago.”
Joel
Yeah. He says they’ve become dull of hearing.
Andy
Yes. Yeah.
Joel
What does that mean?
Andy
Yeah, I think that’s got to bring us back to chapter 3, where he talks about the hardening effect of sin’s deceitfulness. So, I think their hearts are harder now. They’ve been marinating in sin’s deceitfulness. They’ve been tempted by the world. They’ve been enticed to go back from a courageous, bold testimony of Christ, as we’re going to find out later in the book, how they joyfully accepted the confiscation of their possessions because they were convinced that they had better and lasting possession in Christ. So, they were at that high level. Now they’ve regressed. They’ve backslid, it seems, and so they have become hard of hearing. I think it really has to do with the hardness of the heart. They’re not as yielded or supple to the leading of the Spirit anymore.
Joel
Yeah. That makes a lot of sense. This dull of hearing, dull to hear the word of God, it doesn’t have the same piercing effect on your heart like it used to. So how do you think this would’ve felt for them to hear that they ought to be teachers, but instead, they still need milk? How would that have felt to receive that rebuke?
Andy
I think it must’ve hurt. I mean, if they were serious about walking with Christ, if they just blew it off, then you’d wonder if they’re even converted. But you really have to feel that the Apostles, the writers of scripture, the prophets, are speaking for God. They’re speaking God’s words. So really, behind the human author, you have to hear a heavenly Father who is expressing disappointment in one of his children or in a group of his children. Anyone that really loves his or her father, you hear something like that, it’s going to crush you. It’s very hard to hear. I think the idea is to spur them on toward loving good deeds, as the author is going to say later, to provoke them to get moving. There is this heavy-handed feel here of, “I am disappointed with you. I expected you to make progress faster than this and instead, you’re very slow to progress.”
Joel
Now, what would you say to perhaps somebody listening who as they’re hearing these verses, they feel themselves in that position. Maybe they were saved three years ago, five years ago, 10 years ago, maybe longer, and even just as we’re reading this, they realized they haven’t progressed hardly at all in the Christian life. They do believe, but they’re not progressing. What kind of advice would you give them?
Andy
Well first, I just want to encourage such a person for even listening to a podcast like this. It could be that the Holy Spirit is working in some marvelous ways to draw you back toward the word of God or perhaps, for the first time, toward a careful study of the word of God as never before. That is clear evidence of the Spirit’s working, so I just want to speak a word of encouragement to somebody like that. But in general, I think there is a feeling here of a pressure, or even a rebuke or correction to somebody that has a long time been at a level of immaturity in the Christian life, that that’s not okay, and that they need to be spurred to get up and to exert themselves. There is an effort here, or there is a sense of personal exertion in holiness, personal exertion in growth. So yeah, it’s sovereignty of God, absolutely, but also, he works in us to will and to do according to his good purpose. I think there’s the idea of you’ve been neglecting this, you have sinned in being still immature after all this time.
Joel
Right. So, God commands us in 2 Peter, he says, “Grow in the grace and knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ.” (2 Peter 3:18) Then Paul says, it is God who gives the growth. So, I guess you’ve already explained then how to put those together.
Andy
I don’t fully understand it, but I think we just need to know the rules are different in sanctification than justification. In justification, our works are not welcome. We need to abandon them, check them at the door, they will not help us. We are never justified by obedience to the law of God, cannot be. We are justified by Christ’s obedience to the law, by his works, not by ours. So, we have to trust in him by faith alone, through grace alone, not by works. But when you get to sanctification, there are so many verses and so many exhortations to us to, like it says in Philippians, like I mentioned a moment ago, work out our own salvation with fear and trembling. So, we have to work at it.
“We are never justified by obedience to the law of God, cannot be. We are justified by Christ’s obedience to the law, by his works, not by ours.”
Part of it, I think, is this whole epistle, an epistle of warning, an epistle of rebuke, a sharp epistle. It’s needed. We need to hear this. We need to sometimes be jolted wide awake by words like this. So, once we do, we’ve got to get going. So, for here, it’s a doctrinal question. It has to do with the fact that they have to develop a taste for, and perhaps even teeth for, to follow the metaphor, teeth for advanced doctrines in the Christian life, to not just continue to sip on the idea that there is a good God who made everything, and he sent his Son because we’re sinners, and if we believe in Jesus, we’ll be forgiven. That’s all milk to move on to something deeper, something fuller and richer. That’s what this text is urging us to do.
Joel
So that leads into my next question. What is the significant difference then between the infants he mentions and the mature? You mentioned the ability to chew on tough doctrine. Why is it so important that we be able to understand deeper doctrines? Why can’t we just be satisfied with understanding Christ in my place, I’m going to heaven.? Why do we have to press on, specifically towards deeper doctrine?
Andy
Yeah, well first of all, I want to branch out a little bit and say this isn’t the only passage of scripture that talks about the milk-meat dichotomy. 1 Corinthians 3 does as well. In there, Paul is just as put out with them as this author has put out with his audience, and there you’ve got Paul rebuking the Corinthians for being fleshly, or sometimes the translation is carnal, and he says, you need milk, not solid food or meat. So, the milk-meat dichotomy, you’re going to see it there as well.
So, in a recent sermon in 1 Corinthians, I was thinking about what is milk? What is meat? So, I’ve just defined milk as basically those doctrines, those initiating doctrines that you would share in an evangelistic setting with somebody who is finding out about the Christian life, or that you would believe to become a Christian. Meat then would be advanced doctrines. Now, we’ll keep it simple. The doctrine about Melchizedek must be meat because the author doesn’t want to give it to them yet. He holds it back. So, in his mind, that’s meat. So, once you read what that’s all about, the typology of Melchizedek, the fact that there are types, shadows in the Old Testament law, I think the idea with meat there is of a complex array of doctrines that gets built up, building block by building block. So, it takes time to accept this, and accept that, and put it all together, what the old Covenant even was, what was involved in it, and how it was a type or shadow of Christ, and how Melchizedek fits in and who he is. He’s going to develop all that, but that’s meat. It’s complex doctrine that gets built up by building blocks.
Another way to look at meat would be those things that I think are very difficult for us to accept and understand, initially. They make no sense to the carnal mind or to the unconverted mind. So those would be controversial doctrines, things that are hard for us to accept like predestination, election, God’s sovereignty, providence, things like that. Anything that we are wired to reject, it’s going to take spiritual teeth to chew into that. Then finally, just the idea of denying yourself and taking up your cross daily and following Christ, that’s there at the beginning of the Christian life, but we don’t really know what that means, and we start to learn it more and more in that. The cross itself, ironically, is both milk and meat in that regard. It’s the initiating doctrine, but you’re never going to walk away from the cross. The rest of your life, you have to learn what it means to deny yourself and die. So, mortification of sin at a deep level, all of that is meat.
Joel
Right. So, this is incredibly glorifying to God then to see his people pressing on towards maturity, towards diving into the meat, the secrets revealed in the Old Testament, the deep things of God.
Andy
Yeah, it is glorifying to God. First of all, we’re taking him at his word, and we’re thinking that the things he’s saying to us through the scripture by the Holy Spirit are worth listening to. Think how rude it would be if you visited, let’s say, a grandmother, a grandfather maybe in a rest home or just in their own home, and you just feel like they talk too much, and they just talk, and talk, and talk, and you just check out, yeah, yeah, yeah. You’re being very rude, actually, very rude. Effectively, what you’re saying to that person is the things you’re saying are not important to me. The things that you’re talking… You just talk too much.
I almost feel like infant Christians are saying to God, “You just talk too much. You say too much. I got it. I believe in Jesus. My sins are forgiven. I got it. Why do you need 66 books to say all that?” It’s like, wait a minute, now. All scripture is God-breathed. Everything in this book is worth studying, worth our full attention. Those things that are hardest to understand and hardest to accept, that just shows love for God to say, “I love you so much. I really want to understand what you’re saying to me at these points.”
Joel
Yeah, that’s huge. So, to get really practical, what are some specific duties that someone can take to ensure that they’re not falling into the pattern of this group of Hebrews, but that they are pressing onto maturity, that they’re learning to digest the meat doctrines?
Andy
Well, I would commend two habits that have been helpful for me. First of all, we must be talking primarily here about the word of God and how we handle all of God’s word, because that’s the source of both the milk and the meat. So, we want to be in God’s word, but I would advocate knowledge and breadth, plus knowledge and depth. If you do both of those, you’re going to run into both milk and meat. You’re going to run into them all the time. By the way, there’s nothing wrong for us enjoying the milk. Even as Christians have been around for decades, it’s still wonderful to know that there’s a loving God who made all things, and that he sent his Son, and that we who have violated God’s laws can be and are forgiven by simple faith in Christ. We can drink that the rest of our lives, and there’s nothing wrong, and everything right with it.
But the idea here is, I think, to go on to maturity, to go on from infancy to full maturity in Christ, we need to be in the Word more and more. So, I would advocate some habit patterns of knowledge and breadth, plus knowledge and depth. So, knowledge and breadth would be reading through the entire Bible in a year, let’s say. Or if you have more time, in six months. There are different reading programs that you can get in that through half an hour, 40 minutes a day will get you through the Bible in six months. About half that will get you through the entire Bible in one year. So just begin a regular program of Bible intake every single day.
As you’re reading, you want to meditate on it, and that will bring you to knowledge and depth. So, choose something from your reading, something that maybe you didn’t understand, you hadn’t thought about before, and just pray over it and meditate on it. Maybe do some deeper study in it, do some cross references. One helpful discipline for knowledge and depth is memorization of extended portions of scripture, so that you would choose a book of the Bible, a New Testament epistle like Ephesians or Philippians, or maybe a great chapter like Roman’s 8, or a section like the Sermon on the Mount, and memorize it. As you go over it and learn every word, you’re going to be meditating on it automatically, and your knowledge of the word of God is going to deepen and broaden. I guarantee, somewhere in there you’re going to come across some meat. You’re going to say, “Yeah, I really don’t understand this,” and it’s going to broaden you. You’ll be developing your spiritual teeth.
“One helpful discipline for knowledge and depth is memorization of extended portions of scripture.”
Joel
Well, that is really helpful. Now Hebrews 5:14 says that, “Solid food is for the mature, for those who have their powers of discernment trained by constant practice to distinguish good from evil.” So, what additional information does this verse teach us about mature Christians? Just while you’re answering that, what does it mean to distinguish good from evil?
Andy
Well, first of all, there is built within this verse the idea of habits, of a habitual training almost. So that’s just the language of spiritual disciplines. It’s the idea of just like if you try to get better at a sport, or at a musical instrument, or at some kind of craft, or some art, like painting, you just do it. You have to do it a lot. If you want to learn how to play the piano, you have to just practice, and practice, and practice. This is about doctrine so you’re just again and again, in it. You’re in it, you’re immersing yourself in the word of God, and you’re meditating on it, and you’re discussing it with other people. You’re going to mentors who are further along than you in knowledge of doctrine and asking them. You’re reading books. You’re just in this thing, and you’re spending tens of hours, then hundreds of hours, then thousands of hours over years, training yourself by constant use, the text says, so you’re in the word and developing your spiritual teeth.
What’s going to end up happening with that is you’re going to be training your heart and your mind. You’re going to train yourself to be discerning. It’s going to be shaping. You’re going to be transformed by the renewing of your mind. You’re going to start seeing things differently. You’re going to be developing a supernatural faith perspective where you can see not only the physical world, but the invisible spiritual world around it. Can’t see it except by faith, and faith comes by hearing the word of God. So, as you’re in the Word, you’re discerning, you’re training yourself by constant use, you’re able to discern more and more what’s really going on. The author gives us the discerning between good and evil, so you’re discerning what is righteous, and holy, and good, and those things that are wicked and deceitful, and you’re able to make wise choices. It really leads to wisdom at this point.
Joel
Now transition to Hebrews 6:1-3. He says, “Therefore, let us leave the elementary doctrine of Christ and go onto maturity, not laying again a foundation of repentance from dead works and a faith toward God, and of instructions about washing the laying on of hands, the resurrection of the dead, and eternal judgment. And this we will do if God permits”. So, he urges them to go onto maturity, and then he gives us this list of, I guess the basic principles of the oracles of God. It’s an interesting list, especially the instructions about washings. What do you make of this list, as far as introductory Christian doctrine?
Andy
Well, this would be, I think in context, if you read it in context, this would be the author’s list of milk. So that’s what he wants them to leave behind. Now, keep in mind, leave behind, we need to understand that properly. We’re never going to be leaving behind. What does it say? Faith in God, for example, we’re-
Joel
Not leaving behind Christ crucified.
Andy
Yeah, we’re not leaving that behind, but we’re leaving behind the laziness, let’s say, to say I’m satisfied, that this is all I want, leaving behind the fact that I’m going to be here the rest of my life. So, we’re going to move on. I think it’s about the same thing what Paul says in Philippians 3:13, “Forgetting what lies behind and straining toward what lies ahead.” We’re not truly forgetting these things in the past. So, he’s saying, “Yeah, let’s leave behind these basics of the Christian life.” This is basically his provisional list of milk. It is worthwhile just thinking about what he’s talking about here. We’re going to move on from basic elementary teachings about Christ, and we’re going to go on to maturity, “Not laying again [he says] the foundation of repentance from acts that lead to death.” (Hebrews 6:1) So it starts with that foundation.
Now, the Apostle Paul, in 1 Corinthians 3:11 says, “No one can lay any foundation other than the one already laid, which is Jesus Christ.” So, we have to see that they’re not two foundations here. They’re really the same thing. It’s been helpful for me to see faith as the eyesight of the soul. By that eyesight, we see invisible spiritual realities, past, present, future. One of the things that we see here is the finished work of Jesus Christ on the cross. That’s the foundation laid by Jesus. But here, it’s repentance from dead acts, or one translation has acts that lead to death. So, repentance always has to do with sin. So that’s just two sides of the same coin. Faith in Christ, repentance from sin. That’s what you have to do to become a Christian. That’s the foundation of everything. So, we’re not going to lay that foundation again saying, “Hey, you need to believe in Jesus. Hey, you need to repent of your sins.” We already know that, so we’re going to move on from that. That’s the initial kind of milk that he talks about here.
Joel
So, the ESV says also the, “Instructions about washing, the laying on of hands, the resurrection of dead and eternal judgment.” (Hebrews 6:2) I know you’ve got some insight from the NIV as to what the rest of these things were because talking about kind of basic Christian doctrines. Can you talk about verse 2, and what he’s talking about?
Andy
Yeah. I think one of the things I learned in hermeneutics, or the science of interpretation of scripture, is context is king. So, what we want to do here is look at the immediate context first, always the immediate context, and then one circle removed from that, you can get out a little further. So, one circle removed would be Jewish rituals, but the immediate context is beginning Christian doctrines, and that’s the milk that we’re going to move on from. So, I’m going to stick with that. There’s a word that the author uses here, which is I think rightly translated to some degree by the ESV and other translations, washings. But that could lead you to think we’re talking about Jewish washings here, like the kinds that priests would do, the Ablutions and different things priests would do or people would do before they would… like, Jesus was criticized for not washing his hands before eating, and so these kind of washings.
But I think it’s best to look on it in terms of water baptism. So, the idea is there would be certain instructions that would be tied to your water baptism. Again, Peter tells us in 1st Peter 3, not the removal of dirt from the body, but the pledge of a good conscience toward God. So it is that water baptism, but it doesn’t save you. What does save you is the genuine washing of rebirth and renewal by the Holy Spirit. So, the Holy Spirit’s activity on the human soul is likened to a liquid. It’s likened to the outpouring of clean water. So, we are being washed by renewal through the Holy Spirit. Titus 3 tells us that. So, water baptism then becomes an outward and visible symbol of the inner washing done by the Holy Spirit. But again, this is part of a list of things that the author said, “Hey, let’s move on from this now. These are things we taught you about at the beginning of the Christian life. We’re not going to lay again, a foundation of repentance from dead acts and faith in God, and instruction about washings [it says] and the laying on of hands.” Now, what I would say is these are all things that they would’ve done back then at the beginning of the Christian life. So, you can imagine the laying on of hands, and when, for example, Saul of Tarsus was baptized, Ananias baptized him in water, but also laid hands on him that he might be healed, physically, because he was blind, but also that he might receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. So, I think back then, there were supernatural manifestations, such as speaking in tongues or other miracles that would happen, the working of miracles that showed that the Holy Spirit had come on someone, especially speaking in tongues. So, the idea here might be, “Let’s move on from the things we did when you were first converted.” That’s a good way to sum up this whole list. The washings, instruction about washings and laying on of hands would be beginner doctrines.
Joel
Right. That makes a lot of sense. And verse 3, he says, “This we will do if God permits.” (Hebrews 6:3) So why does he add this, if God permits?
Andy
Very weighty, and we’re about to get into one of the most controversial parts of the entire New Testament. We’re going to talk about a very serious chapter of warning, probably one of the most serious warnings you’ll ever find in the New Testament, which causes all of us to look with fear and trembling at our own souls, and to make certain that we’re making progress in the Christian life, and that we are actually bearing fruit, not thorns and thistles, land that is going to be cursed by God, but we are actually fruitful in Christ. That’s where we’re going so, God willing, do that next time.
But he said, “The overall motion of these verses has been from immaturity to maturity, not laying it again, the beginning foundations, but let’s go on to a full edifice, a full beautiful, ornate structure of Christian maturity and God permitting, we will make that progress.” So, for me, what I want to see as I look at that is say, we will not make even a single step of progress apart from God’s will. There is no independent growth in Christ’s likeness. There’s no independent progress from immaturity to maturity. “If God wills, we will live,” (Paraphrase of James 4:15) James tells us, and here if God wills, we will make progress. So first and foremost, you want to make progress in Christ? Focus evermore on God, trust in God, trust in Christ, put your focus on him and say, “Oh God, would you grow me?” You don’t go off by yourself in some field somewhere and grow up independently, and then come back and impress God with your new maturity. You do it in God or you don’t do it at all. So only if God wills, will we grow.
Joel
I have one final question, and then you can answer it and give your final comments. What does this passage about moving from immaturity to maturity, and we talked a lot about Christian doctrine, what specific application would this have to preachers or Bible study teachers, people leading other people in the word of God? How could they apply this to themselves, and then especially to their hearers?
Andy
Yeah, I think it’s very important for preachers on Sunday mornings to not just preach forever the milk of the gospel, week, after week, after week, after week, just preaching the milk of God the creator, God the lawgiver, we created, we violating God’s laws. We need a Savior. Jesus is the Savior. If you’re repent and believe in Jesus, you’ll be forgiven of your sins, and that’s all they ever preach. They never go beyond that. I think we should preach that, literally, every week. You know that I believe that, and I do preach the milk of the gospel every single week.
But I also want to trust the text, and that’s why I would advocate expositional preaching and expositional teaching so that we can encounter the meat. First of all, even if you don’t have teeth to chew it yet, just to know that it exists, and you’re like, huh, what is that? Even just that first glimpse at a doctrine that’s too hard for you to understand will start growing your teeth. It’ll cause within you an ambition to grow to maturity. So, what I would say for preachers and teachers is do not hesitate. Do not shrink back from proclaiming the whole council of God’s word. Give to people the hard doctrines. Do your best to explain them. If you, yourself don’t know what they teach, then grow yourself by reading commentaries and by meditating it, talking to mentors. If in the end, after all that study you still don’t really know, then do your best to explain it and say, “I don’t really know, but this is what I think.” But in any case, by going through the whole council of God’s word, you’re going to be enabling your congregation to grow spiritual teeth and grow up from immaturity to full maturity in Christ.
Joel
Right. Well, thank you Andy. That was episode 11 in the Hebrews Bible study questions. Please join us next time where we talk about Hebrews 6:4-9, and really one of the most serious warnings in all of scripture. The title is “Tasting the Good Gifts Without True Conversion.” Thank you for listening to the Two Journeys podcast, and God bless you all.
